John Edward Cooper’s Notes

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Chris’s interview with his brother David, 6 March 1977

Chris: …The date is the sixth of March, 1977. We’re at Billericay, in David’s bedroom. The topic of our conversation this afternoon is—David Jones. “Jones is Mog”, etc. Now— David, if you can cast your mind back to your experiences in Thornton Cleveleys, first of all I’d like to discuss possibly the incidents whereby, I believe, David Jones offered to buy your services for some meagre sum, and you sold him false information about me and Cooper. Can you recall any of these incidents, to, you know— that we might be able to put in the future copies of Jonezine?
David: The only one I can remember really would be the battle over the fields, wouldn’t it.
Chris: Yes, well that wasn’t exactly—
David: —When I told him you were going to be over there; he was going to go and meet you and Cooper—with his briefcase.
Chris: Did you?— Sorry, I’m not entirely in the picture; can you explain this from the beginning? I can’t quite remember all this.
David: I was selling him this information for an ice cream or threepence, whichever was nearer.
Chris: Yes. How did this actually come about?—sorry. Did Jones try and pump you for information?
David: Oh no, I started it.
Chris: You went up to him and volunteered information?
David: Of course!
Chris: I see. You creep!
David: —Being a bit of a mercenary!
Chris: You creep! You sold me down the river!
David: He would give me threepence, or if we were near a shop he’d go in and buy me an ice cream.
Chris: Would he!
David: Yes—he was very good fun!
Chris: Yes. And so, what? You went up to Jones, then, and— Can you remember the scene? What did he say? I mean, did he call you an “insect” and accuse you of bothering him?
David: That sort of thing, obviously, yes. He’d always come out with that. He seemed very interested when I said that you were going to meet— wanted to meet him over the field, down Hawthorne Road. He said he’d be there with his briefcase—giving me its name. I don’t know what the briefcase’s name was.
Chris: Albert.
David: Albert the briefcase, yes. And I came back and told you that he was going to be over there, and he wanted to meet you over there.
Chris: Did you? What was the purpose of this meeting? Was it—?
David: Oh, you were going to have a battle.
Chris: Oh, a battle. And Jones paid you for this information, did he?
David: Of course. All I would have got off you was a good kick, I suppose, really. And you were planning to go over there, but you never did materialise.
Chris: Did Jones turn up, do you know?
David: Yes. I know Jones was there because me and Swan were there.
Chris: Oh, you watched— You sort of were—
David: We were concealed.
Chris: Yes. —Waiting to see what happened. And what happened? Jones turned up, did he?
David: Jones turned up, brandishing his briefcase. He waited for about ten minutes, then left again.
Chris: Did he? Can you remember any other incidents where you sold him information at all?
David: I don’t really remember any incidents; but when you found out I was selling him it, you took the money back to him.
Chris: Did I?
David: Yes. I’d got threepence off him and you took it back to him. So who’s the creep now? Ha, ha!
Chris: I suppose I am, then! Ha, ha! Well I was probably friends with him at that time; I didn’t like to think that he was being sold incorrect information about me or Cooper.
David: I have very vague recollections of Jones and the Courtroom; I heard about that. That’s already in your journal, isn’t it.
Chris: No, we haven’t actually put that in yet. That’s in— something we’ve got in abeyance for future editions. Obviously, when Jones was brought bef—
David: —Sold you out to the Middleton Empire!
Chris: Well, he did, yes. And he was— Having conceived the idea of holding a Disciplinary Court, he was the first member to be brought before it, which was very ironical, we all thought.
David: Ha, ha, ha!
Chris: When he— When we, having pre-judged him—before he even appeared, we decided he was guilty—when we pronounced sentence on him, or pronounced the verdict, he stormed out of the house in a rage.
David: Yes. Was he in the Labour Party or Conservative.
Chris: Oh, Labour!
David: Labour, yes.
Chris: He didn’t look much like a socialist, but—
David: […] I remember he was going to batter me if ever I started shouting what I thought of the Labour Party again.
Chris: Well come on, tell us more about that, because I don’t recall any of these things, obviously.
David: You remember those cables that used to be on that plot of land in Hawthorne Road?
Chris: Oh yes. Yes, there was, wasn’t there.
David: —And we—me and the mob—were playing on them? We used to hurl all kinds of abuse about the Labour Party at him.
Chris: When he was sort of passing by, was it?
David: Yes. With his red rosette on […]. He warned my mother that if it happened again he wouldn’t be responsible for his actions.
Chris: Ah, yes! I seem to remember that now.
David: That’s about all, really. He came round “door-to-door”-ing, didn’t he.
Chris: Oh, he used to go canvassing.
David: And I told him to go away, and threw his leaflets at him. He never came again.
Chris: He was annoyed about that, wasn’t he. Yes, I remember him coming to the house and telling Mum that if he heard you saying such things again he wouldn’t be responsible for his actions.… OK, well thank you very much, David. That was very interesting—
David: Is that it?
Chris: Is there anything else that you can recall, that might be of interest to readers of the Jonezine? Circulation is increasing, of course, and anything you can think of that might be amusing—
David: Only the name Jones—that’s amusing, isn’t it? Where did he live? Mayfield—? Mayfair, was it? Mayfair—?
Chris: Well, he lived at 53, Victoria—
David: 53A!
Chris: 53A, yes! 53A, Victoria Road. Davelyshome!
David: Who?
Chris: Davelyshome. That’s what he called his room. He lived in 53, but his room was 53A; and he called it Davelyshome—because he and his teddy, called Curly, shared it. So it was Dave-, ly-, Davelyshome. He then moved into Park Road—do you remember?—11, Park Road.
David: That’s when I first started getting to know this—object.
Chris: What, when he lived in Park Road?
David: Yes. “Mums” and “Dads”.
Chris: Yes. OK, right! Thank you very much indeed. That was most interesting. I’m sure that readers will be very keen to listen to what you have to say. Thank you very much.

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